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TBN Reader Submission - Corruption Inside the Navy Base

PAX RIVER NAS - 10/20/2009

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By The Bay Net User 'TILLIMACK'

On Saturday Oct. 17, I was involved in a car accident on the Patuxent River Naval Air Station. I was driving coming to a four way intersection with all four lights flashing red. I came to a stop and noticed a white car far off to my right. I proceeded to cross the intersection but half way through I noticed that the car was approaching too fast and did not appear to stop or slow down so I attempted to speed up to avoid it but I couldn't.

The vehicle hit the back passenger's side of my Jeep and caused it to spin out of control and flip. Attached to my seatbelt I waited shocked by what just happened. The man who hit me, a man in a khaki uniform and green jacket approached me concerned and waited with me till help came.

Regardless of who was at fault, I automatically felt intimidated by his high ranking uniform. I was taken to the hospital by ambulance after the accident so I was unable to give a full statement at the scene. The next day, 0ct. 18, I met with one of the officers from the scene to give my statement at the parking lot just inside the second gate of the base.

I wrote my statement and after I was done the police officer attempted to hand me a pre-written ticket that stated that I had failed to stop at a red flashing traffic light. At the time of the accident there were no other vehicles in sight. So how could I get a ticket off a conclusion?

I refused to sign and accept the ticket. Then the police officer advised me that at that point I had only two options, that I either sign the ticket or that I would be arrested and taken to jail. My mother and I both refused many times and every 5 minutes it seemed that more and more military police officers approached.

They intended to intimidate me and threaten me with arrest. I again refused so the officer that was initially giving me the ticket called his Sergeant and told me that when he came that I would not be asked again and again, that he would give me my options and if I refused I would be arrested on the spot.I told them that I was going to call the state police because that did not sound right to me at all but the MP said that it would be a waste of time because they had no jurisdiction there.

I felt hopeless and intimidated and as though I had no rights. In the end I signed the ticket but I felt like I was intimidated and wrongfully accused of something I did not do. How is it that I got hit and almost died and recieved a ticket but the high ranking official got a warning? Where is the justice or is the military base a free zone in which they make up and create their own laws?

News Feedback NOTE: Views expressed below do not reflect the views or opinions of The Bay Net, Bay Media Services, Inc. or the employees of Bay Media Services, Inc.

Comment On This Story!

rdy4rlchng	10/20/2009 at 12:26 PM
Really?
I am sorry that you were involved in an accident at all let alone one on the base but I think that you over reacted to the ticket. You were in the wrong based on your own accounting of the incident and should have signed the ticket. Even if you felt that it was unwarranted you should have signed it. Signing a ticket is not an admission of guilt it is like signing a receipt that you were given it. It even says on the ticket that failure to sign can lead to your arrest. If you wish to fight it then hire a lawyer and go to court but do not write a letter to the editor, claim to have been railroaded and want sympathy because someone else wore a uniform and you didn't,and by the way khakis do not equal high ranking, just that they serve our great country. So stop your crying, and get over it. Hope you recover from your shock and injuries soon.
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CountyLady	10/20/2009 at 12:56 PM
Reply to rdy4rlchng: Why was he at fault?
I disagree with your answer. It was a 4 way stop and the white vehicle was not at the intersection at the time that the author was proceeding through the intersection. He should not have to hire an attorney at his expense to fight a ticket that he did not deserve.

Tiph	10/20/2009 at 1:04 PM
Reply to rdy4rlchng: MPs DO TRY TO INTIMIDATE!
I was involved in a minor accident on base earlier this Spring. Me verses uniformed khaki personnel. I was taken into a room and by a female and male officer who automatically pointed the finger at me when the other driver was clearly at fault. I even called a family member who is a County Police officer and told her what had happened. She also said the other driver should have been ticketed. The female MP was very rude and intimidating, well she tried to be! I ended up receiving a non-moving violation ticket, no fees or points. I have been in your shoes TILLIMACK and the way MPs handle situations are ridiculous!

mister880	10/20/2009 at 12:45 PM
what you should have done
you should have accepted the ticket right away and ended it there. the ticket was issued due to the report the officers recieved. the officer felt you were at fault, and a ticket was issued. if you feel you were wrong, you take that ticket and fight it in court. even if you called the state police, they would have probably laughed at you and then escorted you to jail if you refused signing the ticket. this was explained to you when you recieved your drivers license, you do have one i am assuming. they were not "indimidating" you, they were stating the law. stop your crying, if you're going to continue to cry - maybe your mother will care cause i for one don't wanna hear it. i do hope you recover from your accident.
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nasser5233	10/20/2009 at 1:20 PM
Reply to mister880: Interesting
I find it interesting that no one has mentioned the key point in your story. That you were at an intersection with four flashing red lights, which means that it needs to be treated as a four way STOP sign, which means everyone must stop first from any direction. And if things were as you have stated, the other person obviously never stopped at the flashing red light which leads me to believe they are at fault. Anyone else out there notice this discrepancy?

CountyLady	10/20/2009 at 1:34 PM
Reply to mister880: Reply to Nasser 5233
I agree with you, read my post that I submitted earlier.

Alvey54	10/21/2009 at 11:52 AM
Reply to mister880: ASSUMING
You know what happens when you do that and you did make a a** of yourself. What part of the story did EVERYONE NOT READ..."I came to a stop" He had the right of way it is VERY CLEAR that the "uniform" was in the wrong. Stop telling him he over reacted, I would have been pissed off too. Take it to the CO of the Base Captain Macyko. What he is trying to accomplish is "if no one knows something is wrong how can it be fixed". And majw89 stick to the subject at hand we are talking the BASE NOT out in town. Hello if you look at the picture there is at the very least ONE STOP sign and I too have been here for 10 years and as of late when Gate 2 was closed the light @ Cedar point abd BUSE was sometimes flashing RED 4 ways.

MattKerns	10/20/2009 at 1:07 PM
Wow
You were wronged in my opinion. I believe you shold fight that especially since you say you did stop and there is no witnesses around to say you did or did not. I do not believe you should have signed the ticket and called the state police and see what happend from there. Base cops have nothing to do but di** around with people and act all tough. There not.
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NTNG	10/20/2009 at 1:14 PM
Corruption?
Sorry about your accident, and hope that you have recovered. As far as your letter to the editor, what exactly were you trying to accomplish? Garner sympathy? You said: " How is it that I got hit and almost died and recieved a ticket but the high ranking official got a warning?" Did you write the letter from a lap top while in the Shock Trauma center in Baltimore? While I dont doubt you may have been injured, I would think if you were near death, writing the letter to the editor would not be on the top of your priority list. You visited the scene the next day. That alone would indicate that any injuries recieved were not life threatning. As far as the "high ranking " official, the uniform does not nessacarily mean he was the base CO or the Admiral. His wearing the uniform was not an intimidation method, its what he wears to work! As far as a "every 5 minutes it seemed that more and more military police officers approached." again, they were not trying to intimidate you, they did not all get on the radio and agree to show up at your incident and try and intimidate you into complience. They probably showed up because they had nothing else to do! Lastly, you said: " Where is the justice or is the military base a free zone in which they make up and create their own laws?" In a sense you're right. They do "make up thier own laws" The DoD and the DoN have rules. Lots of rules. including rules about driving on board a military installation. The NAS Pax. River instruction for traffic safety is 35 pages long.Driving on any military base is at the discretion of the Commanding Officer, a conditional priviledge he/she grants you, provided you follow the rules of the installation. The DoD officers and sailors assigned dont make the rules up as they go along. It is certainly NOT a free zone, as you refer to it. As the other writer said, stop your crying, get over it. Go to court, plead your case. THATS where justice is metted out, not at the hands of a police officer or MP trying to do thier job on a rainy day..
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hooligan77	10/20/2009 at 3:49 PM
Reply to NTNG: oh lord...
" How is it that I got hit and almost died and received a ticket but the high ranking official got a warning?" Did you write the letter from a lap top while in the Shock Trauma center in Baltimore? While I don't doubt you may have been injured, I would think if you were near death, writing the letter to the editor would not be on the top of your priority list. You visited the scene the next day. That alone would indicate that any injuries received were not life threatening." Funny I was thinking the same thing while reading this. You almost died but made it on base the next day to give your statement???? ok. I also agree with a few others on here, there are NO 4 way flashing intersections that flash red on all sides. The main road flashes yellow and the side streets flash red. Now go put on your big girl panties and deal with it. Glad your ok though.

Wrangler4me	10/21/2009 at 7:42 AM
Reply to NTNG: Yes, please, TAKE IT TO COURT
The bottom line here is, take it to court. It is your word against the individual who hit you. It sounds like he was going fast enough, THROUGH THE FLASHING RED LIGHT, to hit you and flip your Jeep. I can understand your frustration, however a letter to the editor will get you nowhere and allot of opinions you probably don't want to adhere to. GO TO COURT

Mac10	10/20/2009 at 1:18 PM
Corruption? please!
this is the silliest thing i've heard. Any moron knows you have to sign the ticket, it's acknowledging receipt, NOT an admission of guilt. That's why you have the option of taking the ticket to court. And I cannot believe the BayNet ran this story given the writers obvious ignorance of how to handle a ticket. They had every right to threaten to arrest you if you did not sign, you are required to sign, period. Take it to court, not the BayNet. Also, khakis don't imply rank, why would you have been intimidated? Not sure what is funnier, the story or the fact that BayNet ran it as "Corrupton" on base?!!!
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angelbaby	10/20/2009 at 1:21 PM
Isnt there a speed limit?
Hello! If the vehicle was going fast enough to hit your vehicle and make it flip they were OBVIOUSLY speeding! Isnt the speed limit like 35mph on base? Take it to court, and have no mercy on them!
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Nut_Jobz	10/20/2009 at 1:52 PM
Reply to angelbaby: This is for all you Nut Jobz defending the police.
Did you know half the police officers on the base are there for one reason? That being they can't make it with other police departments because of violations, and the MP's the base should really take another look at them. They let unauthorized personnel on base all the time, and how can you expect kids (MP's) to know their head from their a$$. So TILLIMACK, go ahead and get yourself a really good lawyer, take it to court beat it. Sue the crap out of the personnel in the uniform that hit you and send them on their marry way. I wouldn't have signed the damn ticket either, take me to jail. NTNG, your an idiot, just don't speak anymore.

majorhavoc	10/20/2009 at 4:10 PM
Reply to angelbaby: Jeep
RILLIMACK, a Jeep tends to have a higher center of gravity and therefore it would not take as much effort to have it turn over if the driver lost control. So the guy in uniform didn't need to be speeding to cause the Jeep to flip. Whether he was or not, I don't know. Also, I agree that the light is not a 4-way flashing red light. It flashes red from the side road where you were coming from. It's been my experience that the main road has been flashing yellow everytime I go thru it early in the morning and on weekends. I do not think you have a case and should have been more careful especially since it was rainy and slick.

jimmyjamesv8	10/20/2009 at 1:34 PM
No 4-Way Stop
You are all missing the main point. Any of you that frequent PAX know that there are no 4-way flashing stop lights on base. Looking at the picture you can see that this happened right infront of the firehouse. That light flashes yellow on the main drag and is flashing red on the two side roads. He obviously thought that the officer had a red light and would stop. However, he had a yellow and clipped the kid as he went through the light after failing to yield the right of way.
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bshill	10/20/2009 at 1:52 PM
Reply to jimmyjamesv8: You are correct.
On the weekends the lights go to flashing. But they are not 4-way red. The lights flash yellow for the primary flow direction and red from the secondary road. So she failed to yield right of way.

somdforever	10/20/2009 at 2:18 PM
Reply to jimmyjamesv8: Wrong intersection
I'm sorry, but I do believe you are wrong in that this happened at the firehouse intersection. If you will notice, there is a stop sign in the picture. An intersection controlled by a 4-way traffic light does not have stop signs. Not that it matters, but just thought I'd point it out.

majorhavoc	10/20/2009 at 4:18 PM
Reply to jimmyjamesv8: Correct Intersection
The stop sign you see in the picture is the exit to the Naval Health Clinic so it did happen at the firehouse intersection.

fly_navy	10/20/2009 at 1:39 PM
Wow, what a tale....
I don't believe I have ever, in my 14 years on base, seen that particular light flashing red. If it indeed was, one would think that common sense may have a big role to play. You stated that you saw a white car coming, but decided to proceed anyway. Common sense dictates that the other driver may have his/her head firmly implanted in their a$$ and therefore you should wait and be sure that they are going to stop. Next, I have received a ticket in the past on base. You must sign it. It is that you acknowledge the receipt of it, not that you are guilty. You have the option to go before the base commander (Capt Macyko or a designated rep) to dispute it much like you could go to court in Leonardtown for an offense on 235. The court will determine who was at fault and what to do about your ticket. Kakhi uniforms have nothing to do with guilt or at fault. Third, TheBayNet should be ASHAMED of even printing this story with this title.
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dmham33	10/20/2009 at 2:15 PM
Reply to fly_navy: No 4 way Stop Lights
I have never in my 11 years of working on this base seen a 4 way stop light. I was working here on Sat and can say with certainty that all of cedar points road lights where flashing yellow

sidewinder	10/20/2009 at 2:17 PM
Reply to fly_navy: What?
You must be joking, that light is always going on the blink. It was doing it Monday morning in fact at 0600 and the cops weren't even there to direct traffic yet.

SdWild1ne	10/20/2009 at 2:17 PM
This was...
probably some E-3 and below or E-4 who was picked on in the Navy by the chiefs or who ever else made this persons life rough. So they got out and are causing problems as a civilian on base. I used to be in the Navy and we saw this all the time.
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rumblebee85	10/20/2009 at 2:27 PM
Sorry.....
Sorry bout your accident.....glad to hear you are ok. Seriously though, its a base ticket...its not like you have to pay for it. You should have signed the ticket and moved on. But nooooo.....you had to make a big deal about it and not sign it. Then feel the need for sympathy and write a letter to the editor of the baynet so everyone can see how foolish you are. This is the kind of topic you should have vented about on facebook so your friends can feel bad for you. Not on the baynet where you can have every military member in town flip out on you. Good luck lol.
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NTNG	10/20/2009 at 2:37 PM
Thanks for the laugh
Hey Nut Jobz, Ok, I'm an idiot, and your a friggin' Rhodes Scholar? Let the rest of us know when you're not going to sign a ticket on base so we can all watch you get hauled off by the "cant get a real job DoD police officers", or the "dont know thier heads from thier a**es" SAILORS. Thats right, Sailors. Not kids. Sailors. Next time you're sneaking your way on base, be sure to call them kids. To thier faces. Never mind the gun, cuffs, and pepper spray. Call 'em kids. Give them a hard time, threaten to sue them. Go ahead, they like that kinda stuff... Oh yeah, its MERRY way, not MARRY way.. Sorry, as an idiot, I just could not resist. But you knew that...
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2goodcandles	10/20/2009 at 2:57 PM
Reply to NTNG: question
was it a military officer that wrote you the ticket or was it a blue uniform officer? Just curious - military are in the cammies and the blue are contactor police NDW.

xcoustic	10/20/2009 at 3:06 PM
Reply to NTNG: You people crack me up
Yes I am guessing the writer probably made a mistake and assumed it was a four way red. Should they have been ticketed? probably, Should they have signed it? Yes it isn't an admission of guilt. However The other person should have been ticket for failure to yield to traffic in an intersection. They hit the jeep in the rear quarter panel, what were they thinking? The Baynet isn't the place to air your reservation based on assumptions. I would bet you can get the operational state of that light at that time. Should an officer get off with a warning because he is an officer/ Not a chance. It doesn't change the fact that the writer was probably in the wrong as well. Your perception of all red doesn't make it so.

phantomfire1	10/20/2009 at 3:27 PM
Reply to NTNG: LOL
I'm speechless

Nut_Jobz	10/20/2009 at 3:37 PM
Reply to NTNG: NTNG
Sorry NTNG, I'm glad you caught my spelling errors. Didn't know we were having a s-s-s-spelling and g-g-g-grammar contest. I thank you for catching that. The kids (sailors) or DoD police officers apparently aren't qualified enough to investigate a crash scence if they write one person a citation and the other a warning, on one person's account of the incident. They should have conducted their investigation on both sides of the story and continued their interview at the hospital if necessary to get the other driver's statement that night, not the next day. Now why did you have to go on with the violence? Pepper spray, Guns, Cuffs, oh my. Please reply to this article and let me know if you found any additional spelling errors. Thanks. Who cares if the driver voiced their concerns on the BayNet and it was posted. Last time I checked this is the United States of America, where he or she can voice, write, (<----Careful that involves spelling and grammar, NTNG might get you) about anything on gods green earth they would like to talk about, according to the constitution. So put a sock in it. All you idiots are able to express your views everyday... Special note for you NTNG, if I have offended you in anyway I apologize for that, so kick back and have a tall glass of STFU.

mom-of-3	10/20/2009 at 4:12 PM
Reply to NTNG: Reply to Nut Jobz
If that was not a four way red flashing light like most are saying and the white car was struck after it stopped and did not yield to oncoming traffic then the person who wrote this doesn't need to tell the cop a thing before a ticket is written. They were at fault (if the other guy only had a yellow flashing light).

PATRIOT1961	10/20/2009 at 6:03 PM
Reply to NTNG: Interesting
Some points of interest, yes TILLIMACK has the right of freedom of speech and ability to vent his frustrations on this website. If he and his mother end up going to court over this, the information here on this website may damage his case. I think we all agree that he was wrong by not signing the ticket. In paragraph 4 he states that the "officer attempted to hand me a pre-written ticket that stated that I had failed to stop at a flashing red traffic light".Given TILLIMACKS possible youngness and inexperience dealing with the law , I can see his hesitation in signing what he believes to be a prewritten ticket of offenses.Prewritten before what appears to be an incomplete investigation.He still should have signed the ticket. A sticking point here is that no one who has posted messages on this site was a witness to this incident. We can't say for sure what is the truth regarding flashing red lights in all directions, TILLIMACKS statement "parag 1" "with all four lights flashing red" One message said that they never see flashing red lights at a four way intersection in the four years they have been on base.... This is inconclusive and has nothing to do with the current events. On this particular day something may have been different than preceding days regarding flashing red lights, Again- no one who has posted remarks was a witness as it appears. We can not defend the officers by saying that "they were not intimidating TILLIMACK. Maybe they were and maybe they weren't , it's way TILLIMACK percieved. TILLIMACKs letter states in paragraph 7 " I got hit and almost died". to the posting by NTNG: YES he was released from the hospital it appears withing 24 hours, no not life threatening. But how dare you trivialize what happened .He could have been seriously injured or worse. It appears that TIllIMACK realizes what could have happened, and I believe he was vocalizing his distress in what could have happened. Is NTNG a military cop defending his badge and the badges of his coworkers. I agree with NUT JOBZ --NTNG is a idiot.. OH NO.. EVERYONE WHO WEARS A BADGE and HOLSTER DOES THIER JOB PERFECTLY WITH THE HIGHEST REPORE and RESPECT, and THERE ARE NO BAD EGGS. Yeah right ,NTNG you werent there or were you ? Next point. TILLIMACKS van turned on its side...road was wet. The opposing white car as it appears struck TILLIMACK,(too bad we don't have picts of the white car and its damages: so we can make a more educated conclusion), according to his letter the white car didnt stop. The problem here is TILLIMACK is making some judgements- 1.Is the white car going to come to a stop?(red light for the white car) Is Tillimack knowledgeble about the intersection-- we dont know. 2.Is the white car slowing ( yellow light ) Did TILLIMACK really come to a full stop as he states...we dont know. What color was the light for the on-coming white car, we dont know. We do that the van TIllIMACK was driving appears to have been struck from the side or rear clipped. Since we don't have statements from the other driver we cant make conclusive judgements on this incident. We cant say for certain that TILLIMACK was at fault or not. We are certain that the opposing car was traveling through a intersection with enough speed that when at impact with the van caused it to flip.(DID the white car have a yellow signal or was it red, and how did TILLIMACK see a red signal on the opposing drivers side,, ( just asking, I have been at interesction where I can see the opposing signal). Final-- the insurance companies will decide in the end who pays for what damages. Luckily this time no serious injuries. Looks like some signage is needed at this and other 4 way intersections to warn drivers that opposing traffic either has to stop or has the right of way on yellow caution) I have seen this done outside,civilian, or on other military posts. Most of all when people jump on a band wagon and get defensive about something being written about someone they know or someone they work with the truth sometimes gets distorted -all the facts werent given particularly with is incident. I can see that alot of postings are people who are defending without all the facts. I see some posted messages where some of the opinions are passionately defending those who wear khaki or who are MPs.(HOW DARE WE SAY someone who wears khaki or is a MP could be in the wrong.) Please defend based on facts not because they are your friend , colleaque or you knew the person involved ...truth must pervail. May we all think with a clear head and a steady hand. May God bless those who serve protect and defend the freedom we enjoy.

A$h_ole	10/20/2009 at 7:02 PM
Sorry
First glad that no one was seriously injured and that it can be worked out. Next is the fact that NTNG is spell-checking peoples comments while overlooking his own. Come on man!!! We all know that "thier" is spelled "their" I noticed you had corrected it in the first comment but failed three times in the second. Then there was "nessacarily", "recieved", "threatning", and "metted out"? I think you mean matted out! Maybe it was the heat of the moment or just stupid fingers but clearly grounds for not correcting others. Next time don't get off the subject and put yourself out there with directed insults unless you are sure it will not backfire. In the end the sun will come up tomorrow and it's another day.
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X-Fusion	10/20/2009 at 8:12 PM
Welp..
I hate to tell you, but I feel absolutely NO sympathy for you. Instead of doing the right thing and accepting the ticket and taking it to court, you made a scene and wasted the officers time. It doesn't matter if you felt it was wrong or not. You should've taken the ticket, said thank you and I'll see you in court. Instead, you stood in a parking lot after writing a written statement and acted like a fool, even after you were warned that you would be arrested if you kept refusing. And to top it all off? Instead of keeping your mouth shut, you run to the media and give people the sob story of 'I was intimated, feel sorry for me!' I don't, you shouldnt've acted like a damn fool. And then you say your going to talk to the Maryland State Police? What authority do they have on a federal institution? None. The best thing you could've done besides accept the ticket was kept off the media, because all you've done is hurt your case.
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rghjr	10/20/2009 at 8:22 PM
Same type of comment
Even when I woke up in 3rd hospital after brain surgery and a coma, that wasn't considered life threatening. I agree, sign a ticket, defend in court. You talk with who ? Any normal citizen or officer should give you the same information. Fight your fight in a court of law, it should not intimidate you. That is away from people that might intimidate you. Writing this letter make you feel good ? I hope you get closure. If your story is correct, you were right. In court, it will be shown. But, the day aftwards and you not know the other vehicles driver ? That should be known by you and your insurance company. Some information should have been given to you or relatives at the hospital. But, to be sure, your comment about the accident is understood and we all hope a quick recovery, but we all hope you can understand the responsibilites of your driving privilege. All our luck, good luck in court.
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ks1924	10/20/2009 at 8:58 PM
ANGRY WIFE
Nut jobz perfect name for a single 54 year old jacka$$ who has nothing better to do besides criticize others for the career choices. You have no idea why these women and men work for the police department and exactly why would you care? Im sure you can find something to do... Some people who you say dont know there heads from there a$$es choose to protect your sorry a$$ and all you can do is pick, please get a life.. I will support my husband and his career choice he provides well for his family and for his country. I have never been so offended before today and all these statements that have been made. The plain truth is the law signing a ticket so you can choose to accept or fight it. REALLY HOW STUPID GOD BLESS THIS COUNTRY AND OUR FREEDOM OF SPEECH.
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Nut_Jobz	10/21/2009 at 9:44 AM
Reply to ks1924: Reply to ANGRYWIFE : )
Perfect name for a 54 year old? Try 28 sweetie. I have some clues, why these men and women work for the base police department. Maybe some of them have taken a dangerous controlled substance, and can't make it into the local or state police academies. For instance, any controlled dangerous substance other than marijuana prohibits anyone from becoming a local or state police officer. Oh yeah, and they also have to pass a polygraph test, where the base police do not. How do I know? Been there, taken the test. I would have been a third generation police officer for MSP. So don't tell me what I do and don't know. I chose a different career path because I know the hours my father and grandfather worked, and I didn't want that for my family. I'm not trying to pick on anyone I was commenting on the a** that was saying the kid was in the wrong and should be ashamed to put this on the BayNet. Who cares if he does or not, it's here say? I care about these people working for the base police, because obviously they can't judge a traffic accident correctly and the little 3 month training they do is worthless, and the EVOC training, lol. The only thing they are good at doing is chasing alarms. The badge they have is worthless it means nothing off base. I am grateful for your husbands work. It takes a lot to be away from their families for 12 hrs at a time, especially to guard the Rec. Center. You are correct, it is the law and the kid should have signed the ticket. But, he also felt he was being wronged, which according to his side of the story was correct. So therefore, I would have made a bigger deal about it and had them take me to jail. Don't be mistaken Blue protects Blue period, and the uniform will protect the uniform. FYI a flashing yellow light means proceed with caution, and a flashing red mean proceed after stop. So it will come down to the flashing of the lights, and the kid needs to take some video and photograph of the accident scene and the lights for court.

RavensFan69	10/20/2009 at 9:17 PM
Continuing Trouble
I to had been involved in an accident many years ago on base. I was ticketed when it was a joint fault accident. It wasn't until civil court before the real truth came out and Legal decision was made. The base police are not qualified true accident investigators. They don't have the experience that the state police accident investigators had. If they would have measured where your vehicle was struck, sounds like to me they could have seen that there was a 4 way stop condition and you had right of way. I wasn't there this is only my interpretation. It is obvious there is base security commenting on this post so of course there will be bias. I think this individual deserves to have their opinion heard and respected or have we completely converted to Obamaism where only certain opinions are valued.
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LCB21	10/20/2009 at 10:25 PM
perspective
At that intersection all the lights flash red sometimes at around 1 or 3 in the morning. It is very possible that the person who controls the lights could have made a mistake that day. In my perspective I tend to belive that both were at fault, the writer of this could have been a little bit more cautious, but the other person could have clearly seen that they were coming toward a white jeep and slowed down or tried to avoid it. If the light was red green yellow whatever, Does that give you the right to come at full velocity toward a car? But every one has their own perspective. Alot of people can say that when it comes to the military every thing is based on what rank your in and its believable that is the case in this situation! Feel better.
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DILLIGAF2670	10/20/2009 at 11:07 PM
Some Facts
The traffic light your accident was at has never been a four way stop. The main roadway is flashing yellow and the secondary roadway is flashing red, this means the main traffic remains flowing without stopping and the side street traffic has to stop. So you were in the wrong. Second, you are on a military installation where a whole bunch of military people work and last i checked they wear uniforms. If this intimidates you, then don't go on board. Where is the justice you ask? I believe it was served. Thank you and have a very nice day.
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funtime65	10/20/2009 at 11:54 PM
This is not right!
You should contact Admiral Halsey about this incident.
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Free_Falling	10/21/2009 at 6:51 AM
Reply to funtime65: to everyone
First of all stop hassling the guy...maybe he overreacted sure... But everyone knows the lights are always breaking. countless times I am leaving work or coming to work and the lights are flashing red because they broke. So I am going to say that this guy is probably telling the truth. Stop calling him an idiot for saying it was flashing red because yes.....they do it. Yea maybe he should have just signed the ticket but understand that he felt he was being wrong. The guy who hit him was at fault. He stopped the car that hit him didnt. It is very wrong that he got a ticket and the other guy got nothing. and this isn't uncommon. The military gets special treatment all the time. They don't wanna lose any of their people so they get away with ALOT!!!! trust me i know friends and family members in the military have shared many a stories of how they got off of things they shouldnt have. Sure the military is important they save our countries....doesn't mean the guy should have gotten off for hitting this dude. Believe it or not (for all those military people out there...) if your not military you are hassled alot by cops. So stop griping and harassing this dude. He felt he was wronged and he was its called freedom of speech people. If he wants to write a letter informing the public of the wrongdoings from his accident....let him. I know I sure am happy to know I'm not the only contractor/civilian that got wronged or hassled just because I'm not military. Guess what....the united states need us little guys too. So leave him alone. And yall are the idiots for calling him an idiot about that light. just to prove yall wrong...next time its on the fritz again i'll take a picture for yall. Then yyou can see you are the real idiots.

AK2SM0188	10/21/2009 at 2:28 AM
WOW
Ok first sorry to hear of the crash. I would most certainly agree with the earlier post that said to contact the Base Commander. I just got out of the Army, and just as an FYI it is a DOD policy that the local police will have authority on any DOD Land i.e. military bases(this includes all four services). Second, most MP's are like that. Sadly most are trained for a job they never truly due, and the ones that are really being the cops dont get to do it enough. Lastly, people and uniform always stick together, its the way we are trained and the way we survive. It is sad when it gets taken to far and other people get the short end of the stick. I hope you wont let that affect your view on the military or any one assoiciated with it. However to summarize.... Go to the Base CO, explain your story, and it should get resolved. Civilians almost always get the better end of the deal when they go up the chain of command, the Military wants to present thier best face. If you need help feel free to ask for advice.
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adeezy9183	10/21/2009 at 4:35 AM
You're at fault!!
Cedar Point Road has flashing yellow signals on the weekends because it is the heaviest traveled road on the installation. the cross streets of cedar point road have flashing red signals which is where you were traveling on buse road. the car that struck you did NOT have a flashing red light because they were on cedar point road. Besides, signing the citation is not an admission of guilt, It is just simply stating that you received your copy of the citation. You have every right to contest in court. You made a big deal out of nothing in my opinion, but atleast you are ok. good luck in court
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mrknowitall	10/21/2009 at 4:57 AM
Take it to court
According to your story; if that is what actually happened; the other vehicle did not stop. Should have been his fault. So fight it in court. Yes it sucks that you have to hire a lawyer at your expense. But either do that or quit complaining. It's not worth it.
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ccwatch	10/21/2009 at 5:00 AM
Not sure who is right
Since I don't know the intersection it hard to comment, but let take what I have read. If it was a four way red light situation, then I don't think you were at fault and should continue to fight the the matter in court. If it was a flashing light with red one-way and yellow the other. You were on the red. Then the approaching car has the right-away and your judgement to move into the intersection was wrong. Now on the last matter of the ticket. As it has been explained already. You should have just signed the ticket and taken the matter to court. Signing the ticket does not mean you were at fault. It was just the opinion of the MP officer that you were at fault and can be decided in court later.
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majw89	10/21/2009 at 10:25 AM
What are these cops good for?
I was recently in an acident bcause as I was driving down passed the square a lady decided to cross from Wendys all the way over into the shopping center right in front of me. She said that she was wrong and it was her fault and if her insurance does not pay for the damage then she will but the cop did not write a report. He called it a fender bender and a report is not needed. It was not a fender bender, if someone pulls our right in front of you and are crossing FOUR lanes that is not a fender bender. But now because we have no report we have nothing showing who was in fault which means her insurance is not going to pay for it and now the lady is saying that she never said that she will pay for it either. All because the cop did not write a report. Even he said it was her fault but still no report.. That makes me feel like what are these cops good for? Now she can go and cross four lanes again thinking its ok.. Next time she may hurt somebody.
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dako	10/21/2009 at 4:20 PM
Reply to majw89: What!!?
...There's a Wendy's on the base? When did they open that and where? I swear, I am always the last to know. Last I knew, green jackets (flight jacket?) were not authorized to be worn with the khaki uniform. It shocks me to hear that in this day and age that someone of the 'khaki clad' are not adhering to proper uniform wear. What kind example are you setting for your junior Sailors? I suppose it was unzipped too. As General Patton once stated, "You are always on Parade". Oh. And for all, when referring to a United States Navy Sailor...Sailor is capitalized, same for Marine, Soldier, and Airman. Since this light has failed to opperate properly in the past, the fact that it was raining is cause to question its proper opperation during your mishap (Navy jargon for accident). I would 1: request affidavits(sp?) from all emergency responders to the scene, if you honestly think it was flashing red...and 2: request repair calls (by date and malfunction type) made on this light in the last 6-12 months. They could either make or break your case. These tasks will take a bit of work on your part, and had you been more respectful with the Base Security folks you probably would have readily gotten their assistance on this. Still, it wouldn't hurt to stop by their office, "with your hat in your hand", and ask for their help. Good luck.

freefaller	10/21/2009 at 4:44 PM
Reply to majw89: You're showing your ignorance
I Maryland, if your involved in an accident where all cars are still driveable and there are no injuries, it is not necessary to even call the cops. THEY WILL NOT WRITE A REPORT ON THIS TYPE OF ACCIDENT. Don't blame the deputy (or go on a public website and bash them!) they are only doing their job the way they were trained. You exchange all information with all parties involved. You get the names and contact information for any witnesses and you report all of this to the insurance companies. It is up to them to assign responsibility and liability for the accident. If, while your exchanging information, someone won't or can't produce all of the required information (Drivers License, insurance card and registration, then you call the police. Not having this info is a problem that they will deal with. I might suggest that you carry a disposable camera in your glove box at all times. If your involved in an accident, you can record the scene and have that as evidence. Your insurance company will love you for it. You impied that the deputy/trooper was being lazy and not doing their job. I will tell you they were doing exactly as the law requires and as their traing dictates. Please, before you go and bash the cops on a public website, you should have some idea what you're talking about!

ImpeachObama	10/21/2009 at 3:04 PM
The Truth Shall Set You Free
I spent more time than I would have liked, reading the opinionated post on this one-sided story. Being in a position to know the facts, there is some truth to it. The author of this tawdry tale was at fault for failure to obey a traffic light. The Cedar Point Road traffic light at the firehouse is a flashing yellow for in/outbound gate two traffic and flashing red for Buse Road to accommodate the influx of traffic to the base in the mornings. The "victim" did come to a stop, but proceeded not yielding on coming traffic that had the right of way. To the victim's credit, the inbound vehicle was driving above the posted limit and because of his status, was able to get it "swept under the rug". The Security force on NAS Pax is comprised of a large group of fresh boot-camp seaman just off mama's tit, on a power trip managed by a handful of DOD officers that ignore it and collect a paycheck courtesy of the American Taxpayer. Yesterday, an E-7, Chief Petty Officer, failed to stop at the Gate 2 Security Check Point and obey the sentry's commands. When the patrol officer caught up with the Maroon Ford Van with Virginia tags, let him go with a warning because of his rank. If that had been a junior enlisted military or civilian contractor, they would have been detained and charged. Now you have the FACTS.
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Wrangler4me	10/22/2009 at 8:43 AM
Reply to ImpeachObama: The truth will set you free?
I see that this "story" has provoked allot of controversy about the DOD police, who's right, who's wrong...etc. And as usual, we all get off the mark and forget what the original subject was to begin with. Attacking the DOD officers, MPs is not the way to go. They try to do their job, as they were hired to do. They more and likely get allot of disrespect, but they live with it and just do their job. I'm sure there are a few that are hot dogs and make some peoples' lives miserable. But isn't it the same with the state police and deputy sherriff's? Would anyone be "comfortable" dissing the local authorities as the DOD cops have been in relation to this story? Do I work on base? Yes. Do I know a DOD cop? Yes, I do. He is a hard worker and respectful. I also know DOD firefighters and dispatchers. I also know they are there because they want to be, not because they "settled" for the positions. You were very unclear about "being in the position to know the facts". Were you there? If so, you need to call the DOD authorities and let them know you were a witness. I have had enough of this whole thing and again, this individual just needs to go to court with an attorney and figure it out.

lilfratt	10/21/2009 at 9:11 PM
Just The FACTS!
First I want to make it clear, that DoD Police Officers (Blue Uniforms), are US Government GS employees, NOT contractors. Most are graduates of a Police Academy, and some are former Police Officers from other Jurisdictions. We are professional Police Officers with many years of training and experience! I know this because I have been one of them for over 7 years. I'm not going to make a judgement on this particular accident because I was not there. This is not the first collision/rollover at Cedar Point and Buse. I will not threaten you with arrest if you refuse to sign the ticket, however, I WILL write you another citation for failing to sign the first ticket.
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emtchick	10/25/2009 at 11:15 PM
Seriously?
I for one, feel very sorry for this women whom got hit from someone who was careless enough to stop at a light. I am just as proud of those who serve our country, But it does not mean he has the right to blow threw a light, which in the laws states, he has to stop at. It does not matter whether it was a soldier, or even the president. He should of had enough common sense to stop and wait his turn. I see this on a daily basis as an EMT. People need to take the time to stop and look and follow the law and lights. These things could turn out way worse than they look. Would you still be defending this man who hit the lady abiding by the law if he had killed her from not stopping at the light? Or what if it was your daughter or husband or even someone you cared about most. You wouldn't justifying this man's horrible driving choice. I hope this woman recovers in great health.
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navytex1980	10/27/2009 at 4:14 PM
Not true
The light on the cedar point road is a falshing yellow. I was working the day and know for a fact. They would have not changed the lights for a little while you failed to yeild the right of way so get over it.
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